[sacw] sacw dispatch #2 | 6 July 00

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South Asia Citizens Web - Dispatch #2
6 July 2000

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The Hindustan Times
6 July

THE PERVEZ MUSHARRAF INTERVIEW [Part I]

by Bharat Bhushan

HT Executive Editor Bharat Bhushan travels to Pakistan to get to know the
General. Excerpts from a freewheeling, yet exhaustive interview. The
interview took place at General Musharraf's residence -- Army House --in
Rawalpindi Cantt. on June 29.

Ask those who know me, I'm trustworthy: Musharraf

The General is wearing an off-white pathani suit and looks remarkable
relaxed after a full day's work at 9 PM. Behind General Musharraf, on the
wall, hangs a calligraphic masterpiece on leather skin with Surat Rehman
inscribed on it -- in which God tells man about all the bounties that he
has bestowed upon him and asks him "Which one of these will you deny?" Much
as India may like, it too cannot deny the existence of General Pervez
Musharraf. However, whether General Musharraf proves to be one of the
bounties bestowed by the Almighty on the people of Pakistan, only time will
tell.
On the other walls of the room, there are some original Mughal miniatures,
a woollen wall-hanging depicting Baloch soldiers with their traditional
beards and turbans on horseback, a Chinese water colour showing what look
like rhododendron blossoms, and a couple of swords in golden scabbards --
perhaps state gifts from some West Asian countries.
Sitting in the ante-room of Army House -- once occupied by the
Commander-in-Chief of the Northern Army Command in British India -- General
Musharraf, however, does not for a moment resile from the known Pakistani
positions on Kashmir and other related issues.
Even after taking over as the Chief Executive of the country, General
Musharraf has not moved into the Prime Minister's official residence,
preferring to stay in the Chief of Army Staff's residence in Rawalpindi
Cantonment. This also keeps him closer to the GHQ.
His house is flanked on the one side by Golf Road and on the other by
Murree Brewery Road which still houses the fully functional Murree Brewery
owned by novelist Bapsi Sidhva's brother Minoo Bhandara. Field Marshal Ayub
Khan was the first Pakistani occupant of Army House. It was later occupied
by Zulfikar Ali Bhutto who renamed it "The Presidency". General Zia ul Haq,
perhaps fearful of Bhutto's ghost giving him sleepless nights, converted it
into a guest house and preferred to live in a much smaller house down the
road. General Mirza Aslam Beg stayed here and so did the subsequent Army
Chiefs.
My interview had been fixed for 8 PM but I had been told that the General
was running late. When he finally arrived, he apologised for having kept me
waiting, saying that he had come in late from Islamabad and wanted a wash
and change of clothes before meeting me. He then sat down and said that I
could go ahead and ask him anything. I began by asking him about his
childhood and his memories of partition.
Childhood, Intellectual influences
Question : General, how old were you when the Partition took place? Do you
have any memories at all of that time, what was happening around you and
how you came to a brand new country?
ANS: I was four years old then -- almost exactly four -- as I was born on
11 Aug 1943. Frankly, I have no memories of that period. I remember that we
lived in house that was built on a big plot of land in a sort of hollow
square. However, I remember the train journey we took to come here. We were
all a bit scared. My father had been given Rs. seven lakhs to carry to
Pakistan by the Foreign Office. He was an accountant then. It was kept in
an iron box. I remember my father sleeping with his head on the box or
sitting on top of it or keeping the box next to him. Seven lakhs was quite
a lot of money in 1947.I remember him guarding that.
Q: You are a unique head of the state in South Asia as you still have
relatives across the border. Do they write to you? Are they proud of your
achievements and have they tried to establish contact with you?
Ans: Frankly, I am not in touch with them. My parents were in touch with
them. In the past they did come here and to that extent I was in touch with
them. The last I met one of my uncles -- my father's cousin -- was about
ten years back, if not more. After that I haven?t had contact. My parents
have gone to India and have been meeting them. But my relatives in India
have not tried to establish contact or told me how they feel about me. ...
May be they are scared that if they expose themselves, they will be
tracked?
Q: You have been a brilliant soldier and may have had many military heroes
but now you are emerging as a statesman. People would like to know the
political influences on you ? Who are your political heroes?
Ans: That's a difficult question. As far as Pakistan is concerned
Quaid-e-Azam. Certainly he is a hero to every Pakistani and to me also. I
respect him from the core of my heart not just because he created Pakistan
but because I think he was a great human being . Other than him, I haven't
given much of a thought to the question of who my political heroes are.
Q. You spent your childhood in Turkey. Were you influenced at all by Kemal
Ataturk?
Ans: He did not influence my thoughts as such but I always respect him for
what he did for Turkey. And since I am a soldier I read about him and about
his campaigns to create this modern Turkey from the Sick Man of Europe. I
am impressed especially by the campaign in Gallipoli where he, along with
three hundred thousand Turks, opposed the allies. I respect him for both
his military and political achievements in Turkey.
Strategic Restraint Regime
Q:You have proposed a strategic restraint regime with India. What could be
its various components? Are you proposing a verifiable ban on missile test
flights or a verifiable ban on fissile material production, for example?
Can you be more specific on what the strategic restraint regime would
consist of?
Ans: This is nothing new that I am proposing. Internationally there are
four legs of the elephant as some people call it -- CTBT, FMCT,
Non-proliferation and a strategic restraint regime. This basically deals
with guarantees against any accidental or irresponsible employment of any
nuclear device. In that, it can deal with geographic separation of warheads
and delivery systems, non-mating of the systems, etc. These are things that
are internationally known. So I was not proposing anything new.
Q: India thinks that strategic restraint regime that you are proposing is
premised on keeping India confined to South Asia. Because of its
geographical size and the size of its economy, India believes that it is
poised for a larger global role. Do you agree with this view? Does this
necessarily mean that India is hegemonistic in South Asia?
Ans: Yes, certainly. I have been saying it openly that India shows
regional and global aspirations. It certainly wants to become a global
military power also. At least as first step India wants to become a
regional military power and it does not want anybody to challenge its
status. So to this extent whatever India is doing is really contrary to
whatever is happening around the world.
Because whatever military power one has -- whether it is conventional or
unconventional is based on a threat perception. The Indian case is not
based on a threat perception but on its own designs and desires for the
future. It is increasing its defence budget by 28 per cent and going into
the unconventional field in a very offensive manner. So all these obviously
lead to conclusions from this side that they certainly do have hegemonic
designs.
Terrorism, Jehad
Q:You have often said that you are a man of peace and against terrorism.
Do you think that terrorism has to be fought both at the level of ideology
as well as denying it the "instruments of terror" or the "hardware of
terrorism" as it were -- the weapons, the land mines, the explosive
devices, the communication equipment that the terrorists use, etc.? What
can nation states do to fight terrorism at both these levels?
Ans: Well, first of all as far as the meaning of terrorism is concerned, I
have been saying that this term has been misused and misrepresented where
whatever is happening in Kashmir...
Q. Sir, please do not misunderstand. I am not on Kashmir just now ...
Ans: OK, OK. Whatever may be happening in Afghanistan or whatever
mujahideen organisations one might have here, are being termed terrorist.
If you are implying that these are terrorist organisations, then they are
not. But your question is about dealing with terrorism?
Q:Yes, your Interior minister is on record as saying that there are a
large number of unaccounted for weapons circulating in Pakistan. Once this
hardware of terrorism crosses international boundaries -- it does not
matter in which direction -- and a state is unable to prevent this from
happening, then does this not amount to export of terrorism? What is
Pakistan doing and what should it do to prevent this from happening?
Ans: First of all as far as the hardware and weapons are concerned, we
certainly want to curb the uncontrolled display and holding of weapons. And
we are taking action in this direction. But this is easier said than done.
To disarm and de-weaponise a region completely is almost next to impossible
-- especially, I would like to admit, when our law enforcement agencies are
not all that efficient. So trying to achieve total success or total
perfection is next to impossible.
On the ideological side, as far as we are concerned, these are internal
sectarian differences, which are prompting people to undertake terrorist
acts here. There is also a foreign hand in this. Let me openly say that
India's RAW (Research and Analysis Wing) is very active in abetting this
and further exploiting our ethnic and sectarian differences for creating
disturbances and instability in Pakistan. But terrorism, I would say, can
be curbed through better education and by preaching tolerance to the people
involved in these extremist activities.
Q: You have been quoted as saying that Jehad is not terrorism and that it
is actually a tolerant concept. Are you operating with a private language
and definition that others do not share and therefore you are liable to be
misunderstood?
Ans: Jehad is a very large concept actually. Jehad is a struggle in the
path of God, in the path of opposing victimisation against Muslims wherever
it exists. Jehad is also what I am doing in this country against
illiteracy, against corruption. Jehad can be against backwardness. So Jehad
is a very wide concept as such. I understand it in this sense but I do not
know how you take it.
Q: What I am saying is that by and large this not how people understand it
in the popular sense. I is like saying that mujahideen is good word, which
it is not the case in western perception, for example. Similarly, the
meaning you might want to convey with the word Jehad is not shared by
people in other countries. So you are operating with a private language and
if you keep on repeating this you are likely to be misunderstood in your
defence of Jehad.
Ans: Well, yes I agree with you. This concept is misunderstood in the West
and its larger dimension is ignored. One part of Jehad, which is about
coming to the aid of one?s Muslim brethren was revived by the West in
Afghanistan when Muslims from all over the world came here to fight the
Soviet Union. But then this got misunderstood. Nobody asked me to define it
in its wider context.
Way forward on India-Pakistan issues
Q: Does your government accept the Simla Agreement? If yes, then do you
support the restoration of the Simla Agreement?
Ans: I accept the restoration of all agreements-- whether it is the Simla
Agreement or the Lahore process -- as long as it addresses the core issue
and does not get involved or does not waste time on peripheral dramatics.
And the core issue is Kashmir. As long as we address it, if India says we
should revive the Simla Agreement, we will revive Simla and if says we
should revive Tashkent, we will revive Tashkent and if it says we should
revive the Lahore declaration then we will do that.

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[The remaining & conclusive part of the above interview is posted in the
sacw dispatch #3 (July 6, 2000)]

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